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who took the screen printing out of SGIA?

Posted on Wed, 13 Oct 2004 at 14:05



I know we are joined at the hip with our digital brothers and sisters, but I was saddened by the lack of graphic screen equipment at this year's show. If we look at the steady decline year to year, does this mean next year there will be 85% digital...I heard it was 73% digital equipment/related in the booths this year. Why would screenprinters attend the show if it continues at this rate?

The screen printing process and industry is not dead.

Comments boys and girls?

Andy MacDougall
www.squeegeeville.com

Location of Opportunity or Item

Comments

Anonymous says: Hi Andy I reply from nord of Montreal, It the same tink here , all equipement is digital in show, i hope the day at some one make a screenprinters show whit all the equipement we are used. It funny to ...

Hi Andy

I reply from nord of Montreal, It the same tink here , all equipement is digital in show, i hope the day at some one make a screenprinters show whit all the equipement we are used.

It funny to see a new machine , new technologie , but ! some time the technologie have some trouble to! i see some compagnie have it a brand new machine digital but they can't print because the pieces dont fit on machine , so they have to go on print old technologie ( by hand) or they have to bring the old screen printer.

That my personnal comment,

Michel,

posted on: Tue, 10/19/2004 - 12:10pm
Anonymous says: The SGAI decided on the name change without any input from its customers. In my opinion it was a bad choice and I am their largest customer of booth space. Not listening to your customers is a sure way ...

The SGAI decided on the name change without any input from its customers. In my opinion it was a bad choice and I am their largest customer of booth space. Not listening to your customers is a sure way to take something big and turn it into what you saw in Minn.

posted on: Wed, 10/20/2004 - 5:47pm
Anonymous says: Mr.Hoffman, I would have too agree the name change is quite disappointing. I have not gone into the charter to see if such radical changes have been made there, my hope is that the spirit of SPIA/SGIA ...

Mr.Hoffman,
I would have too agree the name change is quite disappointing. I have not gone into the charter to see if such radical changes have been made there, my hope is that the spirit of SPIA/SGIA is still true today. A name is a name,but I have seen churches split for reasons even more minor than this.
The show in Minn. was not that disappointing in my oppinion, the unions prohibiting the manufacturers like yourself were more of a hinderance.
I have over heard thru the industry that manufactures and suppliers are wanting changes to how the show is scheduled and other things. How do we procede constructively from here.
Thanks,
Ken Ferguson

posted on: Sat, 10/23/2004 - 10:59pm
Anonymous says: OK, let's see, we switched from solvent to UV. We switched from one color presses to multi color presses. Now we're encorporating the newer flatbed, UV ink digital technology. Now why do you suppose we ...

OK, let's see, we switched from solvent to UV. We switched from one color presses to multi color presses. Now we're encorporating the newer flatbed, UV ink digital technology.

Now why do you suppose we would do such a thing....let me think......ummmmm...

We didn't do these things because the technology was "neeto" and we looked on it as a new toy to play with, we did it for the only reason anybody should.....MONEY (the only reason I drag my ass out of bed in the morning)

the free market is a wonderful, scary, thing isn't it.

I suggest everyone of you screen printing only shops stay that way. Who needs digital, why it'll destroy screen printing if we let it. (ok, tongue in cheek).

As for the SGIA and how their changing, DUH.

Good Luck
Rocky

P.S. Harken back with me now. NEWS FLASH 1920 "Horse and Buggy Monthly changes its name to Horsless Buggy Monthly......Harness makers are up in arms....news at eleven"

posted on: Thu, 10/28/2004 - 11:22am
Anonymous says: I'm guessing nobody is saying here that digital hasn't arrived (well, maybe Michel) but the original questions are still valid. What concerns us who still use screenprinting (and not exclusively, I don't ...

I'm guessing nobody is saying here that digital hasn't arrived (well, maybe Michel) but the original questions are still valid. What concerns us who still use screenprinting (and not exclusively, I don't have garlic and crosses hanging around all doors and windows in my shop to ward off digital) is the growing lack of graphic screenprinting equipment and supplies when compared to digital at a trade show that was/is for the screen printing industry.

Which then leads to the question, why attend SGIA if it is nothing but rows of large format digital printers and supplies for same. Cool stuff, but I'm not rushing out to buy it, and I don't need to blow a few thousand and a week of time to go see it.

And (toungue firmly in cheek Rocky)...so we go back a few years....everybody burns their records because 8-tracks are now the rage...you don't dump technologies that work and make money just because some flavour of the month shows up.

posted on: Thu, 10/28/2004 - 2:30pm
Anonymous says: I just re-read my post, and I guess I did get a little off point (its soooo much fun to rant, isn't it), but rant without reason is just a waste of space. I too lament the decrease in truly screen print ...

I just re-read my post, and I guess I did get a little off point (its soooo much fun to rant, isn't it), but rant without reason is just a waste of space.

I too lament the decrease in truly screen print related ideas and articles at the shows, in the magazine and on the web (well maybe not on the web, it just goes on and on doesn't it).

When I was selling for Colonial (Coates) and now, when I find myself on the sharp end of the stick, I always looked forward to the "shows" for the awe inspiring gadgets and ideas that were waiting for me at the next booth and the next seminar. Nowadays, it's turned into just a more convenient way to see those confederates and teamates (co-conspirators) that we must, always, leave behind when marching on through our carrers. (leaving only those shows available to me that veer towards the screen printing wasteland known as Southern California).

After 50 years of "doing it the same way" mentallity, I'm not surprised by the "supply and demand" changes the association has felt it's needed to do. I remember fondly the years past that I only needed 10 or 15 Screen Printing magazines to build that plank book shelf in my bachelor pad, now it would take twice that many to get the shelf high enough to accomadate my sterio and speakers (if that is, my wife would allow such a monstrosity in my house).

Alas, even encorporating the lowly t-shirt printing articles into the monthly rag has not been able to keep up the content level that I am used to.

Having said all this, the magazine, web site, and yes the yearly show, while not being as cost effective as just contacting the manufacturer's rep for an indepth understanding and demonstration of the products that interest me, are still my number one source (if not in reality at least in my mind) for information on what's new.

Would I like to drive a Porche instead of the mini van, would I rather like, as Elton John has so tearfully sung, ham in my sandwich than cheese, would I rather my daughters current boyfriend forget the way to my house..............sure.

In short, I'd still rather go to the show than not. I've heard (I can't remember where) that more shows in the future will be in cities (Las Vegas, New Orleans, etc) that may help attract more people (and the manufacturer's we all come to see) and I'll be able to justify to my wife that it's a good thing we make the trip every year.

good Luck
Rocky

posted on: Thu, 10/28/2004 - 4:15pm
Anonymous says: Good Morning All, I see that we've had a rant and a reflection on how things are changing, it's good to get it off our chests. I just want to state my oppinion on the situation. The SGIA/SPTF will always ...

Good Morning All,
I see that we've had a rant and a reflection on how things are changing, it's good to get it off our chests. I just want to state my oppinion on the situation.
The SGIA/SPTF will always be the governing force in the screen printing industry. Currently like any other governmental body it has minorities probing it, kind of the squeeky wheel, gets the grease.
My feeling is quite simple, the whole graphic market is moving to an unsubstantial digital expectation. People think the only equipment that should be available is something that can take the image right out of there mind and transfer it to one sheet or a million within a heart beat.
Digital printing is a good fit in our industry, don't get me wrong. It fulfills a section in screen that has always been a problem, how cheep can we do small runs.
Here is the flip point, traditional litho and offset have ALWAYS had the same problem, but their short runs are nice size runs for screen.
THE SGIA HAS TRIED TO REACH THE MAJORITY IN OUR INDUSTRY AND SAY " WAKE UP, IMPROVE"
Screen printing has the ability to reach over and fill that void of short run litho/offset.
Our quality is there, the problem is most of the industry are squeegee pullers not screen printers.
We have equipment manufactures like M&R, Sakurai and Sias which have continually pushed for faster and better preformance. They have the right direction, the equipment is becomeing closer to self suficent litho's and offset machines.
The catch is we still feed these machines garbage prepress expecting the machines to take a sows ear and make it into the silk purse.
The Wright Brothers did litho printing with broken tomb stones, now those presses run the set-ups off a CD.
Methods of understanding colour and trap for 4-CP, in litho and offset is understood and for the most part taken for granted with them. That same understanding in SCREENPRINTING is NOT EVEN TAPPED.
Instead of the industry fearing digital printing, use it where it fits. Use the rest of your energy to improve and become screen printers that match the proof, and resolution that matchs litho/offset, our inks make the images come alive compared to theres.
Offering customers that kind of quality and predictable and consistant printing will draw them to you rather than you to them.

OK now that's out, where do we go.

Stop with the power struggle, names are not important. The reason for the SGIA is simple, to provide information and a method to deliver it.
Use the courses provided and learn to develope. Linearize our processes and foot print your capabilities, test and learn.
As we learn the SGIA will be able to develope more courses to help improve further. Currently we are polerised we have small shops that struggle with simple methods as well as large shops who have lost enough experianced people and struggle with simple methods. Hence the reason the courses are where they are for the most part. The equipment is available as well as the supplies to get where we need to be. Believe it or not your suppliers have the ability to have qualified technical experts help you get there as well, tell them at the door you will not tolerate finger pointing for problems. Education in the industry is the key
That's my simple oppinion,
Thanks for you time.
Ken Ferguson

posted on: Sat, 10/30/2004 - 2:57pm
Anonymous says: Education is the key....so this is getting off topic a bit, but I agree with much that has been said. If education is the key, and the SGIA and the show are our major opportunity to come together and ...

Education is the key....so this is getting off topic a bit, but I agree with much that has been said. If education is the key, and the SGIA and the show are our major opportunity to come together and get some edjukatin' done, then how come there were like 2 or 3 hands-on seminars/courses for graphic screen printers?

Ken, I just got an email from a fellow in Illinois, production manager at a full tilt graphic plant (offset, screen, digital, vinyl) and he was in a pickle because their one person with hands-on knowledge of screen printing had quit, the guy who was left didn't really know how to set-up or troubleshoot, and the work was piling up.
They have 3 M&R semis , 2 with UV, but all they needed to print was one colour work with no halftones. Lots of jobs.

And they couldn't get anyone to do it. He tried advertising and found no one. The offset and Litho industries have all this high tech knowledge and skilled workers because they have industry wide standards and training facilities in colleges. They are accepted by mainstream society and education facilities as a trade.

We are approaching a crisis point here in North America with screen printing. It is still viable, still profitable, still going to be the adaptible multi-print process in demand for many applications existing and not invented yet. But here's the rub.

Where do we get our trained workers? Where do we get our new recruits to the industry with some basic training and technical skills in the graphic arts? The promise of digital is any idiot just pushes a button. We know that isn't the truth, but that is the assumption, and many people buy it.

Every survey going identifies skilled workers as the number one problem in screen printing. Yet insider training courses like SPTF are only scratching the surface, and if we don't get the arts education system in the USA and Canada to wake up to our needs as an industry then we will continue down the path we are on, working in isolation, handicaped by our low profile amongst the general public, and perpetually starved for good printers.

(Ask yourself why Europe has lots of manufacturers, and lots of great screenprinting - they have 2 and 4 year college courses that graduate screenprinting technicians that not only know how to print, but know press mechanics, prepress, specialized applications, etc etc - Here we have colleges that pump out printmaker majors who have spent 4 years perfecting potato block print techniques. 'Commercial' printing is a dirty work, even though the students all want to know how to print shirts, CDs, posters, decals, skateboards, and all the other screenprinted trappings of modern society. Most go on to careers as Starbucks baristas. What a waste.)

And if we can't even get a trade show together with our suppliers and industry collegues where the best and the newest equipment is there for all to see and experience, on a regular basis, then I think it's a pretty sad situation.

But hey, I'm looking forward to New Orleans. Now I'm going out to the studio and sandpaper the stencils off my 'silk'screens. Nothing better to do now that there's no hockey night in Canada....

posted on: Sat, 10/30/2004 - 7:54pm
Anonymous says: Screen printing education........as to our otherwise second to none college system in America, it's great if your still using elmer's glue and hand cut stensils to make screens to print your t-shirts. I've ...

Screen printing education........as to our otherwise second to none college system in America, it's great if your still using elmer's glue and hand cut stensils to make screens to print your t-shirts.

I've attended a few seminar's at the SGIA shows, and excuse me if I just happend to attend the "seminar for dummies" but I got the distinct impression that they were being directed to the begginer/novice.

I understand that the majority of the businesses that attend the SGIA shows for reasons of education (and the smaller regional shows) are our less sophisticated brothers and sisters producing products that don't need the higher tech process's that 4 color process printers or the higher volumn t-shirt printers need to be competetive. That having been said, these companies are an important part of the overall health of our industry, and for those reasons alone (the fact that these companies absolutely need the SGIA's help in educating themselves with the fundamentals of screen printing) I believe that the show's seminars ARE, in their own way, helping promote our industry and helping to give the solid foundation that these smaller business's need if they have the desire to grow into our capacities and abilities.

As to how we can get the indepth, detailed training we need in our pre-press and printing departments, I can't believe that's even a question that should need answering. I buy approximately 3million a year from my suppliers of pre-press and printing supplies. Here in southern California I have Javier from Autotype, Gary from Sefar, Glen from Naz-Dar, Bryant from Sericol, companies like PGF, OYO, CCI and others perfectly happy to spend days with my people to make sure we understand and can implement the latest/greatest technologies and products that are currently available. (poor Javier has been here so much in the past 6 months I feel we should put him on the payroll)

Now I've been on their end of the equation so I understand that the only reason their doing this IS that 3 million I'm spreading around and that people with less buying power may have a little more trouble finding the education/training they need. I've also seen a few attempts at the private sector to set up seminars and training in a "pay to play" sort of system and I'm not sure how cost effective that angle is.

I guess what I'm trying to say that detailed instruction in the high tech process's that are becomming essential to our high end screen printing manufacturing IS out there. As always , in our capitalist economy, the service and training anyone needs may be difficult to find but it IS out there. Everyone has buying power to someone with the knowledge that they need. Hammer your suppliers for it (my ink supplier actually paid for the training supplied by a prominent pre-press manufaturer, in return for a promise to buy a relatively small amount of product from him). That's why industrial salesman are recruited from the industries they supply and not from the used car industry.

Bottom line, call the manufacturer of the process/product you want to learn about and make them train your people. What do you say Naz-Dar, Sericol, Autotype, Ulano, CCI, Dynamesh, Sefar, Saati, M&R, Thieme.........

Good Luck
Rocky

posted on: Tue, 11/02/2004 - 1:54pm
Anonymous says: Lord Have Mercy. I was just looking for general discussion topics to "educate" myself about screen printing on nylon bags with three color designs. You know, how much time/temp/etc and I ran across a ...

Lord Have Mercy. I was just looking for general discussion topics to "educate" myself about screen printing on nylon bags with three color designs. You know, how much time/temp/etc and I ran across a lot of talking points about a name vs. technology vs. WHAT? We are still out here working in the real world in SC where wages are lower than the National average and all I want to do is work on being the best manual printer I can be to help grow a new business which will in the future grow enough to support automatics and hopefully digital. So, for the time being, do you guys know how to print?

posted on: Sun, 11/21/2004 - 11:56am

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